Political Correctness

[bmh16]

Do you agree or disagree with Political Correctness?

Two things that have really annyoed me, (and just about everyone i know) are:

1. The Nursery rhyme 'Baa Baa Black Sheep' changed to 'Baa Baa White Sheep'.

2. Jelly Babies are removing all Black jelly babies from their packets.


These are just two stupid things that i have named. Their is one or two expections, but its only a tiny minority that i except as plausible in this matter.

Couple of things before i sign off is to say, that this is not a rant towards people who are mixed race, or black. Not too sure if people may take it that way!

Ben

[GafferTape]

First, what do you mean by political correctness?

Second, why does it offend you so much?

Third, Baa Baa Black Sheep has been changed, or removed from usage in some nurseries, true. However, tt is being done because Baa Baa Black sheep alienates the "Black Sheep" from the rest of the flock. Ask a kid which sheep is picked on, they'll tell you it is the black one. Ask them why, and the answer will be "because it is black". Therefore it's easier to just change the word of a silly rhyme and eliminate it.

[bmh16]

When did i say it offends me? I just said it reall gets on my nerves! At school, we were having a debate about it. Even my teacher said it goes too far in the end! Half cast has been changed to mixed race. That is one thing i agree with, as half cast is considered offensive by people who are mixed race/half cast so that is fair.

Ben

[GafferTape]

Originally Posted by biker14

That is one thing i agree with, as half cast is considered offensive by people who are mixed race/half cast so that is fair.

Ben

C'mon Ben, you agree that a term like half cast is offensive, (which it is, highly) yet you continue to use it to describe someone of mixed race?

Why does it then get on your nerves?

[kendgreat]

I agree with Ben here - Political correctness gets on me nerves so much and the annoying thing is that its spreading. Seeing cards that say 'Seasons Greetings' instead of Merry Christmas just piss me off so much. I myself am Half Cast and I do not find the term offensive - It depends on the tone that it is used.

[bruffterman]

As far as I'm aware with regard to the "balck" sheep, it was actually quite prized as black dyes were and infact still are almost impossible to make. I hadn't really thought about the term half cast before but I suppose if you took it for it's literal meaning that is to suggest that a person was taken out of the kiln half way through being cast, then it could be offensive even if obviously rediculas. mixed race is of course a much more generic term, which could just as easily describe someone who is half irish and half scottish, as someone who is half english and half african.

My problem with policatial correctness is the political part, if a big newspaper and tc company decide of their own valition not to use a certain term then that is their decision, but it should not be enforced or pressured in any way. and quite frankly there are bigger things to bitch about, yes your kid being called a n***** in the play ground is not a nice thing, but how about the catholic church teaching thousands of africans that they shouldn't use condoms (and thus get aids) because god says so.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by bruffterman

My problem with policatial correctness is the political part, if a big newspaper and tc company decide of their own valition not to use a certain term then that is their decision, but it should not be enforced or pressured in any way. and quite frankly there are bigger things to bitch about, yes your kid being called a n***** in the play ground is not a nice thing, but how about the catholic church teaching thousands of africans that they shouldn't use condoms (and thus get aids) because god says so.

Nail on Head

Let's stop blowing each other up and focus our energies on some of the massive problems in our world before we start to tackle this overblown PC rhetoric 'problem'

[freeipodhei]

The most rediculous thing i saw was a report in the paper where some cafes did not sell "black coffee", the new PC way of asking for it is "coffee without milk". Society these days.....phhh....i tell you, back in the day..... lol

[the_icks]

I do think that pc attitudes are often abused and open to interpretation. In comedy for example, it is no longer acceptable to make jokes about one legged black lesbians with speech impediment, but it is ok to call Tony Blair a c**t... so where is the line drawn?

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by the_icks

...... but it is ok to call Tony Blair a c**t... so where is the line drawn?

You'd better make sure you do that in your own home too as public displays of dissidence tend to be frowned upon in our Orwellian society:

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/compe...392/68779.html

[mattflower]

I agree with most of the comments above, we unfortunatly live in a nanny state where we have to worry about who we upset . . I say things how they are, to be politically incorrect I call a spade a spade.
I feel that it isn't in my nature to be nasty to someone so if I were to use a term that they found offensive I hope they would tell me.
I do think that some of the stories mentioned above are just that stories that have been blown out of proportion

[ryanhutch]

Yay, my kind of debate.

I agree that political correctness has gone too far, but I don't agree with racial slurs being allowed. I am all for freedom of speech but there are certain things that just shouldn't be said. Ultimately it doesn't matter what people say because if it's absurd and ridiculously offensive then noones going to take them seriously. However (sorry that I keep creating bi-polar arguements) there are things that should be done to stop extreme expressions of racial hatred or xenophobia. Take todays news of those BNP f**kers getting let off of thier charges of inciting racial hatred. No doubt it was on the grounds of freedom of speech. C*nts. (sorry, I feel passionate about this sort of thing because my girlfriend is Chinese and has suffered racial abuse in the past).

Thanks people

Ryan xxx

[bmh16]

Originally Posted by ryanhutch

Yay, my kind of debate.

I agree that political correctness has gone too far, but I don't agree with racial slurs being allowed. I am all for freedom of speech but there are certain things that just shouldn't be said. Ultimately it doesn't matter what people say because if it's absurd and ridiculously offensive then noones going to take them seriously. However (sorry that I keep creating bi-polar arguements) there are things that should be done to stop extreme expressions of racial hatred or xenophobia. Take todays news of those BNP f**kers getting let off of thier charges of inciting racial hatred. No doubt it was on the grounds of freedom of speech. C*nts. (sorry, I feel passionate about this sort of thing because my girlfriend is Chinese and has suffered racial abuse in the past).

Thanks people

Ryan xxx

I agree with freedom of speech. People can say what they want imo. But, for example what said above with the BNP, i thought that was very harsh, and sick what they said, but as is said, i feel you should be able to say what you want, whether you get slated or not.

[Amanda]

I have starred out the "n word" above - I know it wasn't actually being used so much as quoted but I still find it offensive. Please refrain from posting these terms directy again!

Also, before we go any further there are some people getting a bit heated here... I would too because there's nothing worse in the world than racism and prejudice. Disucussions like this can be very healthy and productive, but please remember to keep it civil.

Thanks!

[rockykabir]

I'm all for freedom of speech and I'm not easily offended and I don't mind progs like South Park - which are there to offend! I much prefer people to be direct rather than hiding their feelings - problems are made much worse if we don't talk about em!

But when it comes to the issue of causing offence, then the line should be drawn. It's not a matter of being PC or not - but using your common sense.

I know that a lot of this discussion comes from the recent problems lately - especially with the muslim community. I'm very proud of being British due to it's multiculturism - something which I am v proud to say is unrivalled to most (if not all) the countries around the world. I'm equally just as proud of being Muslim and following my religion - I don't see why the two should conflict.

Rather than seeing the recent developments as being a problem, I try to see them as a means to develop the relationship between communities. Most people don't realise the love of the prophets (note the plural - as well as Muhammad, our loved prophets include Jesus (Isa) and Moses (Musa) - all should be loved as much as others). The unfortunate events have perhaps made a few people realise the strong relationship (like child to parent) with the prophets. As this is such a taboo topic, maybe it'll be best not to joke around with it - freedom of speech shouldn't be abused to allow people to be offended.

The thing is - both "sides" need to change. I was disgusted by some of the actions of the minority (from the muslim community) during the cartoon riots - as well as by the so called moderate politicians and media who utilize the conflict for their own gains. Even in the smaller scale, I can't stand certain people in the muslim community who are offended by "small" things such as being given a Christmas card or a wine bottle by their neighbour

For integration to work, both sides need to be educated and change their ways. To even integrate, your beliefs do not have to be comprimised - I just politely explain to my colleagues/friends that I cannot attend a pub/club due to my beliefs: and in most (if not all) cases, others will understand your situation.

Soz for going off in a tangent there, but I strongly agree that discussion is good - so the more talk the better

[Amanda]

Well said! I have to say giving a bottle of wine to a Muslim is probably quite offensive, but I suppose if it was done innocently by someone who didn't realise this then it could be politely declined and explained.

I think the point in this thread really is that some things can seem silly sometimes. In the first post, Ben wasn't suggesting that the use of racist terms should be acceptable. However, most of these things that seem "silly" to some people really do make a difference to those that they affect. We are better at being sensible about it here in the UK than elsewhere. For example it's still OK to say "black", just as it's OK to say "white", whereas in the US you have to say "Afro-Carribean". In my opinion this is a bit OTT, but if the Black/Afro-Carribean people of America find the term black offensive, it doesn't cause me any trouble to use a couple of extra syllables. Equally, I don't like to be called Mandy, whereas that's fine for other Amandas, and everyone respects that and calls me Amanda.

Is that really true about the jelly babies though? I'm sure the black (well, dark purple colour) ones are still there aren't they?

[Emma]

Aye, i guess it's down to every individual! Some things do seem to be getting towards the ridiculous now, but each to their own, if it offends people for whatever reason, then we have tro respect that!

Like Amanda sais about the 'Mandy-Amanda' thing, and not liking being called Mandy, I wear a hearing aid, not being completely deaf, but to help my natural hearing, and hate people calling it a deaf aid, cos that symbols to me I'm completely deaf, when I'm not, whereas someone else wouldn't think twi e about that!

[arj154]

im asian and i dont get offended if someone said something like that and i have no problem with the word "christmas" even if it has "christ" in the name it is just a name. I really dont see how it is offensive and really shouldnt we all just agree with the culture and tradition of the country? I wish everyone could just not care about all this and just get along without all this rubbish about political correctness

[CRW1]

baa baa black sheep is actually now rainbow sheep that annoys me, also;

brain storm, thought shower (to do with fits)

black board = chalk bord

ginger bread man= ginger bread people

ill think of a few other inamo....

I havent read these threads but i say if other people enter our country (like muslims say) they must follow our way, not us follow their way